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The Four Fundamentalisms
The Four Fundamentalisms
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| atuuschaaw |
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Joined: 29 Jan 2006 Posts: 781 Location: an ahwangan |
One way to come to terms with these forces is to understand the United States as a society in the grip of four fundamentalisms. In ascending order of threat, I identify these fundamentalisms as religious, national, economic, and technological.
read more... _________________ "Speaking the truth in times of universal deceit is a revolutionary act." George Orwell |
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| atuuschaaw |
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Joined: 29 Jan 2006 Posts: 781 Location: an ahwangan |
Kelsey mentioned earlier in this thread about the importance of education and it's ability to provide the tools and abilities to critically examine alternative possibilities. This is an extremely good point and education should be our number one priority. Not just for our children, but for ourselves!
Fundamentalism is steeped in self-righteousness and I'm not just talking about christian fundamentalism and Jensen places this fundamentalism as the least detrimental. In his article, Jensen notes that fundamentalism should be described as any intellectual/political/theological position that asserts an absolute certainty in the truth and/or righteousness of a belief system. In this context, fundamentalism leads to marginalization or complete elimination of any alternative views. This overconfidence in one's beliefs is usually rooted in limited knowledge within certain preordained boundaries and has the tendency to suppress any new thoughts, ideas, and advancements in society. Therefore any form of fundamentalist belief system can usually be identified by the lack of humility among it's followers and these belief systems normally are detirmental and contrary to education, the search for truth, and a sustainable society. The importance of the people to somehow overcome these obstacles is primary imho. Not an easy task as most of you can see from the thread on christian fundamentalism. And that is just the beginning I'm afraid! We are all victims of commodification! As my dear 'ol Grandaddy used to say, "We've got a long row to hoe"! Quote: The common people must find a way to tear the fences of the mind down and begin freeing themselves from the social prisons engineered to maintain a certain hierarchial order. The only way we will see a more egalitarian society is by finding a place, or building a place, where we can somehow shrug off hundreds of years of conditioning by hierarchial societies, and begin building it ourselves. Issues, issues, issues; we have so many issues to confront and discuss before we can actually begin! Opening the mind to new thought is difficult to say the least. I so wish we could find that place of interrelationship where we could hang all our armor and weapons outside the door and somehow find that piece of common ground which will help us overcome all our differences on certain issues in order to really see our full potential of power. _________________ "Speaking the truth in times of universal deceit is a revolutionary act." George Orwell |
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| Elvis |
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Joined: 01 Feb 2006 Posts: 661 Location: Toronto |
atuuschaaw wrote: Fundamentalism is steeped in self-righteousness and I'm not just talking about christian fundamentalism and Jensen places this fundamentalism as the least detrimental. In his article, Jensen notes that fundamentalism should be described as any intellectual/political/theological position that asserts an absolute certainty in the truth and/or righteousness of a belief system. In this context, fundamentalism leads to marginalization or complete elimination of any alternative views. This overconfidence in one's beliefs is usually rooted in limited knowledge within certain preordained boundaries and has the tendency to suppress any new thoughts, ideas, and advancements in society. Therefore any form of fundamentalist belief system can usually be identified by the lack of humility among it's followers and these belief systems normally are detirmental and contrary to education, the search for truth, and a sustainable society. You should listen to Coast to Coast The reason I love this show is that although all the freaks are welcome (and they do show up)... you get a great cross-section of views on every subject. Last night's first hour was about RFID technology, the mark of the beast, insane US control of its citizens, and the proposal to chip and track immigrants. Then this guy shows up. Very imformative in that I learn about the Red Heifer which just made me sick... when I read that Christian fundie Texas ranchers were helping create the apocalypse 'thing'. I've always found the need for Christians to hasten the destruction of the world... very um, Christian-like? Anyway, getting back to atu's quote, a guy called in after all this stuff was presented and said "um, I won't be here". That was his phone call... basically saying world's going to hell, not my problem, never was, fuck everybody but me, who cares, I've got a first class ticket on the Jesus spaceship! The fact that the guest said he believes fundies have misinterpreted 'the rapture' didn't faze the caller. Can you imagine sitting on that ship stuck between buddy boy and cm? New definition of hell! _________________ Henri Ducard: Your compassion is a weakness your enemies will not share. Bruce Wayne: That's why it's so important. It separates us from them. |
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| wm pasz |
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Joined: 29 Jan 2006 Posts: 1219 Location: Toronto |
Quote: Put another way: You don't have to believe that a rust-colored calf could bring about the end of the world — or that 72 black-eyed virgins await the pious Islamic suicide bomber in paradise — but there are many people who do, and are prepared to act on that belief. Just when you think you've heard it all. These people believe that a cow is a sign of the apocalypse?!!! Or, I should say, a sign that it's OK to start an apocalypse?!!! Holy crap. My message to all the kooks:
_________________ Time is on the side of the oppressed today, it's against the oppressor. Truth is on the side of the oppressed today, it's against the oppressor. You don't need anything else. - Malcolm X |
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| yankeebythewater |
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Joined: 04 Feb 2006 Posts: 128 |
Need no dam for fundamentlisms...
I think that is _________________ A Working Class Hero Is Something To Be ~ John Lennon |
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| atuuschaaw |
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Joined: 29 Jan 2006 Posts: 781 Location: an ahwangan |
Quote: Can you imagine sitting on that ship stuck between buddy boy and cm? New definition of hell!
What a trip! _________________ "Speaking the truth in times of universal deceit is a revolutionary act." George Orwell |
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| SharynS |
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Joined: 28 Jan 2006 Posts: 2939 Location: the 'puter |
Is this the apocalyptic cow?
_________________ Free speech is the whole thing, the whole ball game. Free speech is life itself. - Salman Rushdie |
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| atuuschaaw |
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Joined: 29 Jan 2006 Posts: 781 Location: an ahwangan |
_________________ "Speaking the truth in times of universal deceit is a revolutionary act." George Orwell |
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| Mulligan |
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Joined: 04 Feb 2006 Posts: 358 Location: Ground Zero |
Quote: Here, let me simply point out that because a nation-state is an abstraction (lines on a map, not a naturally occurring object), assertions of patriotism (defined as love of or loyalty to a nation-state) raise a simple question: To what we are pledging our love and loyalty? How is that abstraction made real? I conclude that all the possible answers are indefensible and that instead of pledging allegiance to a nation, we should acknowledge and celebrate our connections to real people in our lives while also declaring a commitment to universal principles, but reject offering commitment to arbitrary political units that in the modern era have been the vehicle for such barbarism and brutality. Why is it that Libs* always have to ‘point things out?’ This writer is actually pointing nothing out but his own muddle-headed, ideology-bound opinion -which seems to be that because national boundaries don’t grow into place like dandy-lions, they have no valid reason to exist. This is silly and it flies in the face of common sense. Political boundaries have always been a part of human experience and are clearly evident as part of any given nation’s ability to define itself [I think we all know that intuitively, don’t we? Or is this just an instance in which we get to enjoy another variation of “The Emperor’s New Clothing” story that was once told to children to get them to sleep at night?]. Patriotism, which is so unfashionable in our time with the Liberal elite and its ‘useful idiot’ followers, is an abstraction of the ideals from which a nation and its people are formed. The very purpose of “pledging allegiance” to one’s founding principles is to ‘reaffirm,’ or ‘revisit’ belief and trust in the original purposes of one’s national heritage. Liberals like this writer are very much afraid of any sort of nationalistic pledge of allegiance because such displays of unity among the populace signal strength, and purpose. Liberal strategy is to protect its own ideology by promoting Quote: diversity, multiculturalism, political correctness, and finally cultural suicide; -which, interestingly enough, is exactly the opposite. Holy Cow, Siggy, how’m I doing!? *He refers to himself as one. _________________ The snow is gone. |
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| SharynS |
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Joined: 28 Jan 2006 Posts: 2939 Location: the 'puter |
Quote: Holy Cow, Siggy, how’m I doing!? _________________ Free speech is the whole thing, the whole ball game. Free speech is life itself. - Salman Rushdie |
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| Mulligan |
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Joined: 04 Feb 2006 Posts: 358 Location: Ground Zero |
Quote: In what respect Mull? Typing skills? Interpretation? Absolutism? Please! This stuff is not that difficult. I’m just trying to keep the a/b down to acceptable levels. Quote: Nationalism poses a threat everywhere but should especially concern us in the United States, where the capacity for destruction in the hands of the most powerful state in the history of the world is exacerbated by a pathological hyper-patriotism that tends to suppress internal criticism and leave many unable to hear critique from outside. Here’s another will-o-the-wisp thought that has plagued Leftist think-tank agitators, propagandist, and Marxist university professors for years: the problem of ‘Nationalism.’ What our writer is really saying here is that ‘nationalism is a threat to Liberal elite and its ideological agenda.’ That agenda is to disarm the defenses of the US, dissolve her national boundaries, and obliterate any vestiges of her national identity. This process is decades old and much of it has been ostensibly successful. But its purpose is neither intended to be in best interests of the country, nor to benefit humanity at large, but because it fits the purposes of Liberal ideology. “Pathological hyper-patriotism” exists only in the minds of Liberal ideologues such as this writer. There is no hyper-patriotism that “tends to suppress internal criticism, etc.” The problem is that our writer, and others like him, are always afraid that even moderate patriotic display will reach pathological levels, and so they try to head it off by various means -knowing that many, especially in the universities, and through national media, will buy into it. It’s all about Liberal Ideology. It has little to do with making a better world. _________________ The snow is gone. |
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| atuuschaaw |
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Joined: 29 Jan 2006 Posts: 781 Location: an ahwangan |
Quote: Patriotism, which is so unfashionable in our time with the Liberal elite and its ‘useful idiot’ followers, is an abstraction of the ideals from which a nation and its people are formed. The very purpose of “pledging allegiance” to one’s founding principles is to ‘reaffirm,’ or ‘revisit’ belief and trust in the original purposes of one’s national heritage. I don't think it's about patriotism but it's evil twin "nationalism" with it's focus on superiority. Nationalism and it's jingoistic followers are the abstraction in our time IMHO. With the availability of knowledge at our fingertips, and the transparency this availability brings with it, the certainty which was once attached to moving the minds of the masses is deteriorating. The times they are a changin' M. The life of simplicity, unless you happen to be an anarcho-primitivist, is disappearing as the people share knowledge (not just nationally but internationally). This is bringing about the change in my opinion. It isn't as simple as liberal v. conservative anymore, but goes way beyond that. International communication via the internet is obscuring the once very prominent borders of the world as the people realize their commonalities. And through newfound beliefs and trust, the people are beginning to construct new allegiances and principles to build a sustainable world community. The R-evolution has begun! _________________ "Speaking the truth in times of universal deceit is a revolutionary act." George Orwell |
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| SharynS |
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Joined: 28 Jan 2006 Posts: 2939 Location: the 'puter |
Quote: What our writer is really saying here is that ‘nationalism is a threat to Liberal elite and its ideological agenda.’ That agenda is to disarm the defenses of the US, dissolve her national boundaries, and obliterate any vestiges of her national identity. This process is decades old and much of it has been ostensibly successful. But its purpose is neither intended to be in best interests of the country, nor to benefit humanity at large, but because it fits the purposes of Liberal ideology. What evil festers at the root of "liberal ideology"? How would dissolving borders and obliterating national boundries serve 'it's' purpose? _________________ Free speech is the whole thing, the whole ball game. Free speech is life itself. - Salman Rushdie |
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| Mulligan |
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Joined: 04 Feb 2006 Posts: 358 Location: Ground Zero |
Quote: How would dissolving borders and obliterating national boundries serve 'it's' purpose? Because, in a nutshell, if you do that –if you have the ability to do that, you can erase the identity of an entire nation. I’m not going off about illegal immigration here, but the eradication of national borders is one of the many combined ways that that can be done –hence the agenda that I mentioned. The ‘it’ that you’re wondering about is modern Liberal ideology. Our dear present Liberalism is the façade, or ‘presentable face’ of what is really known as ‘cultural Marxism’ or, ‘Western Marxism.’ Western Marxism, we’ll call it, was developed long ago by two Marxist (Communist) theoreticians; Georg* Lukacs, and Antonio Gramsci. Their purpose was to develop a strategy by which the cultural identity of the ‘West,’(that is, the US, Canada, and one supposes, western Europe), would become dissolved into some sort of mish-mash of popular misconceptions, ideals, and so on. The ‘end purpose’ that you asked about, is clearly to remove all opposition to Marxist belief, which originated with Marx and, over the years, was updated and continued by his many, many adherents. Western culture is quite understandably seen by these ideologues as the only obstacle to world domination. The writer of The Four Fundamentalisms in this thread, Robert Jensen, seems to be typical of those many unwitting souls that perpetuate the ideals of Western Marxism. He (1) probably considers himself a Marxist, or worse (2) has no idea of the origins of his own teachings and writings. In either case he seems to be ‘selling the ground’ beneath his own feet. *That is the correct spelling. _________________ The snow is gone. |
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| Mulligan |
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Joined: 04 Feb 2006 Posts: 358 Location: Ground Zero |
Quote: Nationalism and it's jingoistic followers are the abstraction in our time IMHO. Again AT, I don’t see or hear anything of the sort of Nationalism that you’re talking about except in the instances of those who support our military forces in Iraq (despite their own proclivities about the war itself). Listening to you and reading this article, I expect any minute to hear about some upcoming Nuremberg-style rally complete with tens of thousands of uniformed soldiers marching down Constitution Avenue in Washington to the tune of “Uber Alles,” -complete with untold numbers of cheering, flag waving citizens on each side. The reality of this is -that you really don’t encounter much in the way of nationalistic overture anywhere. Nationalism and jingoism is not the abstraction of the time except in the minds of paranoid Liberals, like your writer here, who are always afraid that someone is coming to get them. Quote: The life of simplicity, unless you happen to be an anarcho-primitivist, is disappearing as the people share knowledge (not just nationally but internationally). No, what’s happening is that people are waking up to what’s really at stake should they happen to lose the current culture war to the kultur klub social engineers. What’s an anarcho-primitivist anyway, one of those bugs that you find in the shower if you live down in Florida? If my spell check doesn’t recognize it, it must not exist. _________________ The snow is gone. |
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