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Why we need to support Obama's Health Care reform

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gordon
Post Posted: Sat Jun 20, 2009 7:05 pm

Joined: 11 Sep 2008
Posts: 67
Obama is nowhere close to a progressive leader. He doesn't have the BALLS to take on the profit-lobbying machine, the HMOs, and take the paper-pushing profit out of healthcare. This doesn't mean not paying doctors what they are worth.It should mean RATIONING also, why should have my mother-in-law at 83 yrs old have gotten a KNEE REPLACEMENT? And the anesthetic gave her an oxygen-deprived stroke, and she never was out of bed afterwards? There should be strict cutoffs, where you pay for the damn procedures yourself, she could have paid for at least 1/2, then she'd still be alive today.
America isn't ready for a radical ANYTHING. But without radical changes, this country is doomed.Now Obama is talking about MANDATING we pay for insurance!.How about a refund for the last 10 yrs when I payed for my own Kaiser insurance at between $6,000 and 12,000/yr, because I was responsible. What now? I pay $15,000/yr for 3? Obama is a sham. Bought-off by the Banksters who put him in office, led by Goldman Sachs-you.
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CR76
Post Posted: Sun Jun 21, 2009 2:29 am

Joined: 03 Aug 2007
Posts: 33
Once again....LT and I totally agree. I really can't add anymore...except as LT believes, HEALTHCARE SHOULD BE A RIGHT NOT SOMETHING NEGOTIATED!!!
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John A. Joslin
Post Posted: Mon Jun 22, 2009 11:27 am

Joined: 02 Apr 2006
Posts: 83
Location: Detroit, Michigan U.S.A. IBEW #58 		My Latest Health Care Reform Moment...

Just caught part of a replay of CBC- TV special on Obama's first official presidential visit to Canada to talk with Prime Minister Stephen Harper.

(... remember when he purchased some cookies to take home etc. )

Anyway , in one up-close & personal interview segment Obama was complimenting Canada on being an "impressive country " that Americans could learn a thing or two from. Since I hadn't seen this coverage before , I hung in there, curious to hear what Obama admired so much.

He then proceeded to say he thought that Canadians have a " vibrant banking system. " Confused

- Ooooof-ed in Detroit , J.J.
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ross53
Post Posted: Thu Jun 25, 2009 9:55 pm

Joined: 24 May 2006
Posts: 1434
Location: california 		Fact Check: The Truth Behind Obama's Health Care Plan.
Fact or Fiction? Decoding the President's Prescription for American Health Care

By RICK KLEIN, BRET HOVELL and Z. BYRON WOLF
June 25, 2009

http://abcnews.go.com/Politics/story?id=7922187&page=1

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loonietunes
Post Posted: Thu Jul 02, 2009 5:34 pm

Joined: 30 Mar 2006
Posts: 1210
CR76 wrote:
Once again....LT and I totally agree. HEALTHCARE SHOULD BE A RIGHT NOT SOMETHING NEGOTIATED!!!

CR76, It is always good when folks can reach common ground especially on such an important issue as this.

Have a very good Fourth of July celebration!

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Laboryes
Post Posted: Mon Jul 06, 2009 1:57 pm

Joined: 29 Jan 2006
Posts: 1959
Quote:
He and other United American Nurses union delegates endorsed a single-payer health care system at their 2007 convention, but he’s convinced today’s Democrats don’t have the fortitude to stand up to the health care lobby. So, he thinks, it’s better to get something than nothing.


Labor Rallies for Health Care, But Keeps it Vague

http://labornotes.org/node/2339

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John A. Joslin
Post Posted: Mon Jul 06, 2009 9:58 pm

Joined: 02 Apr 2006
Posts: 83
Location: Detroit, Michigan U.S.A. IBEW #58 		But Getting “Something” is Better than Getting “Nothing,” Isn’t It?

" Not if that “something” makes it more difficult to reach a real solution and ensures temporary relief will be followed by prolonged suffering. The “public option” may allow some people to buy inadequate insurance products for a short time. But such a system will quickly be crushed by the weight of rising health care costs, as Medicaid, SCHIP and dozens of state initiatives have been. In addition, expending political capital on reforms that we know will fail makes the public cynical and gives ammunition to those who say that the government cannot create effective programs. Hence, any attempt at real reform is delayed, usually by decades. The minor temporal relief that reformers might get by acquiescing to insurance industry demands is simply not worth the continued suffering of the American people. "

- excerpt from: Single Payer Action
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loonietunes
Post Posted: Tue Jul 14, 2009 2:29 pm

Joined: 30 Mar 2006
Posts: 1210
Quote:
There should be strict cutoffs, where you pay for the damn procedures yourself, America isn't ready for a radical ANYTHING. But without radical changes, this country is doomed.


How about this for some Radical change.

We set up a system similar to America's Social Security Retirement where everyone pays into it through a "Payroll tax" deduction or in this case a "Consumtion Tax" if folks don't have a job.

Obviousely, for those that do not work or buy anything, they would be covered as well and able to go to the Doctor of their choice with no rationing of any care for any age group period.

Obviousely, the good and honest Doctors will be busy and make lots of money and the quacks will be fighting to stay open.

The RX trade needs massive regualtions. You shouldn't have to pay $10.00 for one pill.

Yes the workers and buyers paying into this massive trust fund will pay for those that don't work or consume. So what. That's fucking life.

What's wrong with bailing out a brother in need?


No person should ever have to worry about getting any medical care they need at any point of their natural life period from one day old to 115 years old.

No one has a right to declare someone useless and ready for the scrap heap. Fuck this Logans Run mentality and the boat it came in on!

With this huge health insurance problem out of the way folks can then focus on improving their lives in other areas like wages and quality of life and education and improving our climate and building world peace etc.

Like CR 76 and I have said over and over.

Health Care needs to become an absolute RIGHT not a political item up for negotiations.

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John A. Joslin
Post Posted: Tue Jul 14, 2009 5:27 pm

Joined: 02 Apr 2006
Posts: 83
Location: Detroit, Michigan U.S.A. IBEW #58
Quote:
We set up a system similar to America's Social Security Retirement where everyone pays into it through a "Payroll tax" deduction or in this case a "Consumtion Tax" if folks don't have a job.

Obviousely, for those that do not work or buy anything, they would be covered as well and able to go to the Doctor of their choice with no rationing of any care for any age group period.


That's exactly it.

And that's also exactly what pending House Bill #676 ( aka " Single-Payer " ) would /will do. Thinking of the "How are we going to pay ?" question... it helps to think of how we already pay for streets and highways , and how we could be paying for european- style rail transportation while we are at it as well as common -sense health care !!?

The answer is we long ago established a systematic public subsidy intended to benefit anyone and everyone who wants to drive someplace, whether they have a new Caddy, a BMW, or a 12 year old domestic "beater" ( like me ) . Think about it. We couldn't drive around in cars w/o a connected network of paved surfaces , paid for out of the combined wealth of the entire country.

Ever notice how you don't hear the wheezing blowhards complaining about our "socialistic " support system for car owners & passengers ? Rolling Eyes

Everyone in... nobody out . Pick your own private doctor , dentist , or faith healer and all services will be paid for whether or not you have a job.

I'm unemployed , and I use roads and highways with my semi-trusty 1996 Ford Escort anytime I need to. In the same way, we need to unchain the availability of good health care from a person's employment status. ( see: "Single-Payer " plan)


House Bill # 676 (...which my neanderthal , corrupt , and bucket-headed union ( IBEW ) actually *opposes because it would cut into their own kick-back arrangements with the Health Care Industry sharks) is a carefully crafted alternative to continuing the insanely expensive subsidy to the for-profit Health Care Industry . F**k them.

In fact, House Bill # 676 contains provisions for assisting laid-off former employees of the Health Insurance companies who would be forced out-of-business by a "Single-Payer " health plan.!!

Me? ... I would put all those laid-off professional claims- deniers to work at the Pentagon , handling requests for new weapons systems . They're already trained to say , " NO ! " to all comers , so why not put all that training to a good use that will finally benefit some folks ?! Very Happy

- John A. Joslin , electrician ( Local # 58 IBEW , Detroit )

* note: ... not that any Canadian IBEW members are reading this... but I'd say they should be very aware that the IBEW International Union down in Washington, D.C. ( South O' the Border ... ) is actively against a non-profit "Single-payer " health care system in the United States. So, the U.S. controlled IBEW by attempting to preserve the For-Profit health Insurance Industry in the United States is at the same time actually helping to undermine the existing Canadian health care system. The IBEW is aiding & abetting the For-Profit Health Corporations who would dearly love to shove all Canadians back to the pre -Tommy Douglas dark ages where they had a free hand at squeezing sick & injured people for every last dollar they had .
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loonietunes
Post Posted: Wed Jul 15, 2009 1:00 pm

Joined: 30 Mar 2006
Posts: 1210
Quote:
Think about it. We couldn't drive around in cars w/o a connected network of paved surfaces , paid for out of the combined wealth of the entire country. Everyone in... nobody out . Pick your own private doctor , dentist , or faith healer and all services will be paid for whether or not you have a job.

The connected highway example is brilliant.

As long as this plan prevents uthopian social engineers from ever setting up tribunals in charge of rationing medical care based on a person's age or race or creed I am on board John.

On paper the plan you speak of is good but I can see why some heavy hitters from all walks of life are against it. This plan takes the control and the Billions away from these folks that currently have the control and make the Billions and often times use this control and their Billions as a club to beat the little people into submission so as to keep them enslaved.

The last thing that these power hungry and greedy fucks want is for Health Care to become an established Right for all people!

Then what the fuck are these power brokers going to do or use as a hammer over people in order to keep them in check and under control?

If you established Health Care as a God Given Right it would mean one less "D__K" a humble poor person or middle class person for that matter has to "Suck" in this maze of life.

Just like breathing Air. You don't have to ask permission or get approval to do it.

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John A. Joslin
Post Posted: Wed Jul 15, 2009 10:46 pm

Joined: 02 Apr 2006
Posts: 83
Location: Detroit, Michigan U.S.A. IBEW #58
Quote:
As long as this plan prevents uthopian social engineers from ever setting up tribunals in charge of rationing medical care based on a person's age or race or creed I am on board John.

I agree.

For anyone not familiar with the "Single Payer " health care plan laid out in House Bill # 676, and please read it if you don't believe me , it does not envision setting up tribunals like those envisioned in the above quote.

But... in the event we, the public, ever get our act together and see to it that the insurance companies are thrown out of Health care, there certainly will be constant pressure from big money to force their way back into controlling health care as a huge money making machine. They will want to get back into it from the day they are sent packing. Pushing the rationing of health care and backing the appointment of committees or tribunals to take charge of doing so might well be one of the tactics big money would use to undermine and destroy a true public-interest based system of providing health care, thus restoring their traditional suffocating grip on the throats of the American public.

If so , they would be operating on totally familiar ground, since the rationing of Health care is very widespread in the United States , today. Hell it's the diseased heart of the entirely shameful scam. Takes a lot of forms , but the meat & potatoes of health care rationing is that the less access to health care there is for people , uninsured folks of course, but insured folks as well... the more money the Health Industry makes off everyone's pain & misery.

So, even though most of us don't want utopian social engineers installing rationing tribunals in the future ... the bad news is ,most of us ( me included) have indeed quietly accepted health- care rationing right now ... under the anonymous iron thumb of the so-called Health corporations.

As the great Canadian "public" health care visionary , Tommy Douglas, used to say... we sometimes resemble Mice which can make it easy for others to take advantage of us !
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gordon
Post Posted: Sat Jul 18, 2009 9:38 pm

Joined: 11 Sep 2008
Posts: 67
Obama has proven he's in bed with Goldman Sachs and the bankers, GS being the largest contributor to his campaign, he's stacked ex-Goldman Cartel members throughout his administration. They now control as much as 70% of ALL TRADES on the NYSE (April)using at least $60 BILLION in gov't bailouts.This story is just evolving. Go to zerohedge.com, they have been exposing Goldman's High Frequency Trading platform to control the market. Obama knows all about it. He told them to intervene in the stock market to make his programs look like their working. It's called Plunge Protection. Pbama now has 132 programs he's going to "FIX" the Chesapeake Bay, the latest.Don't be fooled, he's bought and paid for by lobbyists, worse than Bush. read this>

What Wall Street Owes You (Commentary)

CNN – July 15, 2009

By Janet Tavakoli

Goldman Sachs Group Inc. announced record earnings Tuesday of $3.44 billion for the second quarter of 2009.

Goldman's stock price leapt 77 percent for the first half of 2009, and closed Tuesday at $149.66 a share.

Without an ongoing series of front- and backdoor bailouts financed by U.S. taxpayers, most of Goldman's record profits would not have been possible.

In April 2009, Goldman Sachs' CEO, Lloyd Blankfein, who received record salary and bonus compensation of $68.5 million in 2007, said that bonus decisions made before the credit crisis looked "self-serving and greedy in hindsight." Now, they look self-serving and greedy with foresight.

Goldman set aside $11.4 billion for employee compensation and benefits, up 33 percent from last year. That's enough to pay each employee more than $390,000, just for the first six months of this year.

In June, Goldman bought back its preferred shares, repaying $10 billion it received from the government's Troubled Asset Relief Program, or TARP, and setting it free of limits on executive compensation and dividends.

But pay is not the key issue. U.S. taxpayers deserve a large cut of the profits, not the chump change -- less than a half-billion dollars -- they got from preferred shares in the company and the relatively small amount they could get from warrants in its stock.

U.S. taxpayers should insist that a large part of Goldman's revenues and profits belong to the American public. TARP money was just part of a series of bailouts and concessions that allowed Goldman to prosper at the expense of a flawed regulatory system.

In March 2008, Goldman, a primary dealer in Treasury securities, was among the beneficiaries of a massive backdoor bailout by the Federal Reserve Bank. At the time, Henry Paulson, former CEO of Goldman Sachs, was treasury secretary.

In an unprecedented move, the Fed created a Term Securities Lending Facility, or TSLF, that allowed primary dealers like Goldman to give non-government-guaranteed "triple-A" rated assets to the Fed in exchange for loans. The trouble was that everyone knew the triple-A assets were not the safe securities they were advertised to be. Many were backed by mortgage loans that were failing at super speed.

The bailout of American International Group, or AIG, ballooned from $85 billion in September 2008 to $182.5 billion. Of that money, $90 billion was funneled as collateral payments to banks that traded with AIG. American taxpayers may never see a dime of their bailout money again, but Goldman saw plenty.

Goldman may be the largest indirect beneficiary of AIG's bailout, receiving $12.9 billion in collateral, including securities lending transactions, from AIG after the government bailed out the insurance company.

The key question is whether Goldman asked AIG to insure products that were as dodgy as the doomed deal from Goldman Sachs Alternative Mortgage Products exposed by Fortune's Allan Sloan in his October 16, 2007, Loeb Award-winning article: "Junk Mortgages Under the Microscope."

If the federal government had not intervened and if AIG had gone into bankruptcy, Goldman probably would not have received its $12.9 billion from AIG. U.S. taxpayers and the American economy are owed some of the bailout money passed directly through AIG to Goldman.

Wall Street firms also reaped trading windfalls when AIG needed to close out its derivative transactions. This was the most lucrative windfall business in the history of the derivatives markets. When AIG left money on the table, it was U.S. taxpayer money.

Goldman Sachs was granted bank holding company status in the fall of 2008. It already had the temporary ability to borrow from the Fed through the TSLF, which would have expired in January 2009. Now it has permanent access to lending from the Fed.

Goldman can now compete with the largest U.S. banks and borrow money at interest rates pushed as close to zero as possible by the Fed. Goldman gets a further benefit: favorable accounting rule changes. In addition, Goldman issued $30 billion of debt with a valuable government guarantee that remains outstanding.

Meanwhile, the American public faces a rising unemployment rate, falling housing prices, rising unemployment, higher local taxes and a dismal economic outlook.

Interested men with reputations and fortunes at stake rode roughshod over public interest. The American public is owed part of the profits Goldman was able to make because of the largesse of our Congress.

Wall Street's "financial meth labs," including Goldman's, massively pumped out bad bonds and credit derivatives that have melted down savings accounts, pension funds, the municipal bond market and the American economy. Risky assets, leverage and fraud led to acute distress in the global financial markets.

The biggest crime on the American economy may go unpunished with no consequences to the perpetrators. The biggest crime was not predatory lending, but predatory securitizations, packages of loans that did not deserve the ratings or prices at the time they were sold. They ballooned what should have been a relatively small problem into a global crisis.

Wall Street owes the American public for its key role in bringing the global economy -- and in particular, the U.S. economy -- to its knees. Goldman is not alone in owing the American public. It is not the worst of all of the Wall Street firms. But among all of Wall Street's offenders, it is the most well-connected, and Goldman was the firm that cleaned up the most as the result of government bailouts.

The opinions expressed in this commentary are solely those of Janet Tavakoli.

Janet Tavakoli is the president of Tavakoli Structured Finance, a Chicago-based firm that provides consulting to financial institutions and institutional investors. Ms. Tavakoli has more than 20 years of experience in senior investment banking positions, trading, structuring and marketing structured financial products. She is a former adjunct associate professor of derivatives at the University of Chicago's Graduate School of Business. Author of: Credit Derivatives & Synthetic Structures (1998, 2001), Collateralized Debt Obligations & Structured Finance (2003), Structured Finance & Collateralized Debt Obligations (John Wiley & Sons, September 2008), and

Dear Mr. Buffett: What An Investor Learns 1,269 Miles From Wall Street (Wiley, 2009).
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loonietunes
Post Posted: Wed Jul 22, 2009 3:11 pm

Joined: 30 Mar 2006
Posts: 1210
Quote:
Obama is nowhere close to a progressive leader. He doesn't have the BALLS to take on the profit-lobbying machine, the HMOs, and take the paper-pushing profit out of healthcare.


I don't agree. I believe Obama deep down in his heart of hearts wants to really change things for the better but as anyone in power ends up finding out, it is easier said than done.

That said, this is why I strongly believe that "Healthcare" should not be the subject of negotiations and must be taken out of the political circus.

If you establish Health Care as a RIGHT which begins at someone's birth and ends at someone's natural death and you fund this RIGHT through payroll taxes and or through a consumer tax making certain all are on board with no strings attatched and no rationing of any kind, you will then cut out most of the middle men who currently make Billions by using Medical Care as a money making scheme.

Granted, getting this done will be as hard as achieving world peace or achieving a clean planet or even good will among neighbors. but I do believe that we must continue the good fight to see that one day we establish Health Care as an absolute "RIGHT" for all.

Sure it's hard and at the moment seems impossible.
But just a few short years ago electing a black man the president of the United States seemed as far from reality as a weekend get-away on the planet Mars.

Nothing is really impossible. It just sometimes seems that way.

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SharynS
Post Posted: Thu Jul 23, 2009 8:50 pm

Joined: 28 Jan 2006
Posts: 2883
Location: the 'puter 		It would b'nice if these articles were clearly dated but assuming it's recent and urgent - better safe than sorry, thought it is of interest?

Key Vote on Single Payer Healthcare
Quote:
Now is the time to phone
your representatives in the House & Senate
and ask them to support Single-Payer HealthCare


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loonietunes
Post Posted: Tue Aug 11, 2009 12:43 pm

Joined: 30 Mar 2006
Posts: 1210
Quote:
On top of all of this is the disturbing notion of private businesses snooping into your personal business and making judgments that are highly subjective and based, in many instances, on incomplete, outdated or just plain old incorrect information.


1-9-8-4

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